The BLB Blog

The official blog of Blue Letter Bible

Does Inerrancy Cause Worship of the Bible? (Bibliolatry)

Posted on Posted by

The following is taken from the BLB FAQs.

Some have objected to the doctrine of inerrancy because it supposedly makes people worship the Bible rather than the God who is behind the writing of the Bible. This worship of the Bible is known as “bibliolatry.”

Do Christians Worship An Inerrant Bible?

The idea is that people will make the Bible the object of their worship if they believe it to be an inerrant or infallible document. Instead of worshipping the God of Scripture, people will worship the very Scripture itself. This approach had a number of weaknesses.

Would An Errant Bible Cause A Greater Desire To Worship God?

First, are we to assume that a untrustworthy, errant Bible would cause a greater desire to trust God? Would this cause assurance that God and His Word could always be relied upon? Obviously it would not.

The Bible Does Not Teach Worship Of Itself

Add to this, the Bible itself does not contain any passage that would remotely give one the idea to worship it rather than God. To the contrary, Scripture makes it clear that God, and He alone, should be worshipped. In the Ten Commandments we read:

You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God (Exodus 20:4,5).

God forbids worship of anything apart from Himself – this includes His written Word. We Cannot Blame Scripture For The Sins Of Humans

While there are people who do have a superstitious attitude toward the Bible, they do not get this from a reading of Scripture. The Bible cannot be blamed for their faults.

Christians do not worship the Bible. Rather, it is the authoritative standard that God uses to make known His truth to humanity. It is the God of the Bible whom they willingly worship.

Summary

The doctrine of inerrancy supposedly makes a person worship the Bible instead of God. This, it is contended, should cause the idea of inerrancy to be abandoned. While some may place a superstitious attitude toward the writings themselves, this has nothing to do with the issue of inerrancy. The Bible does not encourage worship of itself – it always points to the worship of the living God. The belief in inerrancy should not be abandoned because some mistaking worship the Book instead of the God who divinely inspired the Book.

 

Comments

  1. John 4:23
    But the hour cometh and now is when the true worshipers shall worship the FATHER in spirit and in truth for HE seeketh such to worship HIM

    John 4:24
    GOD is a spirit and they that worship HIM—MUST— worship
    HIM in spirit and truth

    John 6:63
    It is the spirit that quickeneth the flesh profiteth nothing
    The words that I speak unto you they are spirit and they are
    life

    John 17:17
    Sanctify them through THY truth THY word is truth

    1 Thessalonians 2:10
    And with all deceiveableness of unrighteousness in them that
    perish because they received not the love of the truth
    THAT THEY MIGHT BE SAVED

    John 18:37
    Pilate therefore said unto HIM Art thou a king then
    JESUS answered Thou sayest that I am a king
    To this end was I born and for this cause I came into the world
    That I should bear witness unto the truth
    Every one that is of the truth heareth MY voice

    James 5:19
    Brethren if any of you do err from the truth and one convert him

    James 5:20
    Let him know that which converteth the sinner from the error
    of his way shall save a soul from DEATH
    And shall hide a multitude of sins

    Romans 12:1
    I beseech you therefore brethren by the mercies of GOD
    That you present your bodies a living sacrifice holy acceptable unto GOD which is your reasonable service

    Romans 12:2
    And be not conformed to this world but be ye transformed
    By the renewing of your mind that you may prove what is that
    good and perfect will of GOD

    Hebrews 10:36
    For you have need of patience that after you have —DONE—
    the will of GOD you might receive the promise

    THANK YOU JESUS FOR THE WORDS OF TRUTH

  2. Realizing that there are between three-four thousand plus organizational groups who ‘are all Christian’ stems from
    this very subject and simply because these have failed in the basic discipline of ‘Thus saith the Lord’. The very clatter
    of the transliterated fundamental of ‘Eklesia’ for example…
    or as the king’s version has presented this leads one away from
    the idea of worship, their identity in Christ both in day to day life and the collective. Church in the KJV leads the way as such…where it should be the assembly, the congregation
    or other wise. The ‘called out’ need desperately to show the Jesus in me (i as well) each and every moment of the days of the week: for ‘the all’ to many who have left the cause of Christ… likely began to gag on the BOOK being the object of in lieu of the Lord for personal and congregational worship. Imagine for a moment in the vast sea of congregations where the condescending context of the expository has the endless ‘we hold the truth’ and all others are errorites. Sadly leaving the Lord outside and sadder yet sending away people in search of the relationship they so desperately need…confused.
    As it was once said…we have found the enemy and is us? Lord
    in these desperate times assist each of us to attain the preservationist, salty-light discipleship as individuals and collectively as we assemble to be the empowered magnets for
    each and everyone in the course of not only today but always.
    Amen…
    shepard
    ovr-n-out

    • Oh Shepard…yes! You are a person of like mind or better said similar inspiration. “The very clatter”…especially over “eklesia”. Thank you for your comments.

      Let me say this about inerrancy – GODS words are inerrant, infallible, trustworthy, faithful, etc., BUT translators from a host language to a target language over several thousand years are not. The very mechanics of translating require interpretation by a sinful creation…. this is where error enters in. Fear not, GOD is inerrant, infallible, trustworthy, faithful, etc. and the best thing of all – with us!
      J.

      • So I’m to believe that an all powerful, all knowing, ever present God is/was powerless to ensure that His word would be accurately translated into other languages which He created (Gen 11:9)? Every person that I’ve read about in the Bible was flawed, but an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent, perfect God was able to use them for His purpose.

          • Maacah, you speak of various meanings, so I thought that this might be helpful: There are “four basic levels of interpretation: peshat (simple), remez (hint), drash (allegory) and sod (hidden).” {Aramaic English New Testament by Andrew Gabriel Roth}.

            Also, I cannot comprehend not having a “NEED” for Elohim, even in perfect Heaven. HE will eternally be my Source, my Creator, The One from whom I receive Eternal Life.

        • No Elijah, you’re not to believe that. I never said anything of the sort. You are reading things into what I wrote that are not there and jumping to conclusions from them. If you would like to discuss, even debate the Greek word “eklesia” and other words like it that enforce the false doctrine of Replacement Theology that is systematically translated into scripture, I’m up for that. But I’m not going to defend something I did not say or allow myself to be labeled as Satan by those who do not even know me. Maybe you and the others who have gotten hysterical over some challenging comments about scripture should ask yourselves if you in fact don’t worship the Bible. The absolute only thing that matters to mankind and the situation we find ourselves in is the BLOOD shed by the Lamb of God 2000 years ago – Nothing else! And nothing I wrote changes that historical event in any way or changes the relationship any of us have with our Redeemer, in fact it only brings us closer to Him and who He is… Jewish!
          Jerry, (a gentile)

          • Yes, Yeshua is Jewish. The Word made flesh, from a Jewish town Bethlehem(the house of bread), and where the most pure and delicious water was found. Replacement Theology is very dangerous! God`s Word should not be taken out of content. There is the Physical meaning, the spiritual meaning, and the hidden meaning. I might be missing one. But I love the Word as it is a Lamp to my feet.Ps.
            Remember what a Lamp does-it sheds light upon the Path of Life that you are walking.
            Thank you Yeshua for being our Light of the World!

          • When did I “label you as Satan?” Talk about jumping to assumptions. I don’t see anywhere in my statement where I challenged your faith or made you out to be “Satan” or evil. I made my statement based on your comment which is: “The very mechanics of translating require interpretation by a sinful creation…. this is where error enters in.”

      • I’ve never had an issue finding the truth when using the KJV (even when digging back to the original Hebrew, Aramaic in some circumstances, and Greek.)

        • In Acts 12:4 the KJV incorrectly translates the word ‘Passover’ (G3957 from H6453) to ‘Easter’.

          I’m not knocking the KJV because I believe it is probably the most accurate of the English translations to the original text, rather I’m pointing out the importance of searching the Scriptures deeper.

          We must remember that this Book was put together by men, but His Word is still true. Elohim repeats Himself on every issue, and even more so on the important ones.

          • What was translated were both words and meaning. Words lead to meaning.

            The KJV was revised 168 times in an effort to be more and more correct in the translation. Originally, the Geneva Bible was used but King James did not like the notes in the margins where they directed readers/Christians to follow God and God alone. King James then had the Bible “translated” and put his name to it.

            Theologians, and I mean good and honest theologians, prefer the KJV. One Greek and Hebrew teacher once told me that if one took one page of a loose leaf Bible and made a record of the “errors,” they would occupy one half of one side of the page, they would deal with names of people or places and they would not touch any major doctrine of the Bible.

            The KJV is trusted and poetic which causes people to prefer the KJV. It is the most-used from the pulpit of strict, Bible-believing churches.

            What is amazing is that while many say they cannot understand some of the KJV, they will pay good money for a course in Shakespeare while the KJV was translated in the same time period and uses the same language. Even a good dictionary lists the meaning of words as they were meant to mean in the times of the KJV’s translation with the italicized “bib.” label so the true meaning of the KJV is more-perfectly understood.

  3. In my experience, inerrancy is necessary for assurance that the God of the Bible is THE (one and only) God.

    Historians ridiculed the biblical ‘Hittites’ (an ancient Iron using culture) until the 20th century, when archaeologists discovered Hittite ruins – exactly as described in scripture. Scientists scoffed at the biblical account of God separated the waters below from the waters above – everyone KNEW that there was almost no water in space (so where is this water above) until planetologists started to discover that water is everywhere in space – craters of the Moon, soil of Mars – just like God said it was in the Bible.

    An errant Bible is just a book by men and like William Blake, we might as well write our own fairy tales. On the other hand, if Wisdom cries out in the market place – and wisdom again and again proves itself to be true – then perhaps there really is something to this Jesus thing. Inerrancy and Truth led this ex-atheist from Darkness to Light.

    • Arthur, Let me ask you to think on this, When the Jewish leaders and Hebrew scribes approached their Messiah in an attempt to protect their own and accused Him of being in fact Satan (to use an English word), did it in any way change the reality that they were in fact speaking to the very GOD they were supposedly experts about? No. The irony of these passages is absolutely delicious. Likewise, archeological evidence found proving to the unbelieving secular so called historian experts that accounts recorded in scripture and were brushed aside for years are in fact true is equally delicious irony. So, have faith, errors of translation in the scripture, intentional or not, in no way changes or weakens the GOD of scripture or the GOD that is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent. HE is fully capable of bringing those whom HIS FATHER gave HIM home even as the wheat grows among the tares. The harvest will come and until then, HE has not left us and never will…count on HIM, not an inerrant bible.
      J.

    • Hallelujah!!
      Don Goldstein was an atheist also and he wrote a book called “I have a Friend who is Jewish do you?” It is a great online read!

  4. With the autographs gone, and with so much riding on how one interprets Scripture, we can praise God that He provided so much proof whereby we can truly know exactly what the Word says. He didn’t limit His revelation to us through one or two people but through 40 plus men on three continents over a 1500-year period. In addition, He gave us the Holy Spirit to guide us into all truth (Jn. 16:13), not some truth or most truth, but ALL truth. We can thank God because He has told us that “All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness” (II Tim. 3:16), so we can find the truth outside one verse or word. In addition, we know that we are commanded to “Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth” (II Tim. 2:15) so that we can personally know the truth outside what any person or any group tells us. If people heeded God’s counsel about His Word, then there wouldn’t be the thousands of groups all claiming to be Christian when they really aren’t. We need to live the Word and share the Word, but we can’t do these things if we don’t know the Word.

    Because I came out of Mormonism, I know first hand that the lie can sound just as spiritual as the truth and that it can be supported by many verses. There are so many viewpoints shared on this blog, and, obviously, they can’t all be correct. I pray that each of us will call upon the Lord to reveal whether he or she is truly receiving instruction from a group or person who is a true disciple of Christ and whether he or she has a correct understanding of the Word. God has no desire to leave us in the dark. We are told, “If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all [men] liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him” (Jam 1:5).

    Yours in Christ~
    Barbara

    • I just had one more thought. The very first thing Satan did was to cast doubt on the Word that God had already revealed to mankind, and he hasn’t stopped through some 6,000 years of history. The first part of the “Eighth Article of Faith” in Mormonism is “We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly.” I don’t know of anyone who wouldn’t agree with this statement, but the implication is that it hasn’t been translated correctly, which plays right into the LDS Church’s agenda because the second half of this Article says, “We also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.” Just as in the Garden, Satan first casts doubt on God’s Word and then he presents the lie. If any denomination is teaching a “new” or “restored” truth, especially through it, then that is a red flag that they are not despite its claims. The bottom line is that if you believe, to any degree, that God has not preserved His Word, then you WILL fall for the lie.

      • Sorry, I left out a phrase. The second to the last sentence should read, “If any denomination is teaching a “new” or “restored” truth, especially through it, then that is a red flag that it is not truly a follower of Christ, despite its claims.”

        • Barabra,
          2Tim 3:1-5 says it all about the days we live in.

          “But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come.

          2Ti 3:2 For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy,

          2Ti 3:3 unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good,

          2Ti 3:4 treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,

          2Ti 3:5 holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these.

          I am glad our teacher ” The Holy Spirit ” writes it on our hearts, and protects us with His peace.

          • Donna~

            Thank you for these verses. They are another reminder of how important it is to work on our relationship with our God so that we will be transformed into the image of His Son and not the world.

            Be blessed in all things, my sister!
            Barbara

    • Good comments, Barbara.

      Also, let’s not forget…
      1Jn 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

      And that the book of 1st John was written to Believers:

      1Jn 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

      Therefore, the Bible vindicates herself as a book. As some say, the Bible explains itself but this is oversimplification. It goes far beyond this and leads us to more and more understanding. A good dictionary, a good concordance alongside, and we have most of the tools needed to give us understanding and insight. However, the understanding is also accumulative: we can go back and reread passages and gain new understanding from other passages. Some of the understanding is seeing parallels or patterns since the Bible is not just so many words, it is ultimate wisdom and it causes readers to become more and more alert to new revealed meaning. I John 5:20 above tells us that this “understanding” comes from Jesus Christ himself and this is no small thing.

      • Bob~

        What you have said is so true. God’s Word is so amazing, but for most of my saved life, I wasn’t reaping the benefits of it because I was not truly seeking the kingdom of God and His righteousness. Life situations brought some much-needed perspective into where I really was with the Lord, and it wasn’t pretty. I was double minded, and I finally learned that God doesn’t open the depths of His Word to those who aren’t willing to walk the walk. I did some cold, hard evaluation and then made the choice to be a doer of the Word and not a hearer only. I began to spend more time in prayer, studying, fasting, repenting, and dying to myself and have found that the more I have done these things, the more God has revealed to me through His Word. There is nothing greater than reading a verse or passage for the umpteenth time and having it come alive to our spiritual senses! It is no more logos but rhema, and it has made all the difference in my walk with Him because now I know that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God. We serve a mighty God who delights in teaching us if that is our sole desire.

        Have a blessed weekend!
        Barbara

  5. “John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
    2 The same was in the beginning with God.
    3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
    4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
    5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.”

  6. God has promised to preserve two things, his words and us:

    Psa 12:6 The words of the LORD [are] pure words: [as] silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
    Psa 12:7 Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

    1Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and [I pray God] your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

  7. God is said to to be so wonderful and perfect. The attainment of such holiness combined with his grace so as to be sufficient to be beloved and share his excellence because it was Jesus our lord who died on the cross so that those who do have faith may be saved from their erroneous ways and learn the fellowship that is the body of Christ and so to carry that message to the world that the truth does lie in his word. Its unfortunate the evil does incite doubt and mistrust into the world so as to carry off sinners to his hell. It is this that we are called in to do his work and save humans from ruin, but what is will and why are we given it? Because god has made a covenant with us to mediate between man and god to which degree of servitude is one called or seeking? So ministering is to those who preach, teach, and listen according to ones own gift of understanding, because god is love and can only be love for god is good like no one can be. Therefore we speak of him in all glory and praise forever and ever. OMNIPOTENT-OMNIPRESENT-OMNISCIENT.
    We then apologize for the dilemma of reality and the course we people choose to live. Lamenting in a sense so that harmony does resound is what?G2G just my thoughts according to that.PEACE.

    • Yes Odidnab, G2G
      Human called at a moment is righteous unless rebellious, sinful. Not righteous is exactly that, not in the image of God. Righteousness is not a bankable merit or fiat that can be applied in lieu of unison with the mind of God.
      Human being is the ordeal demonstrating the glory of God. God, creating human in His image and likeness.
      Can we always be in agreement, evermore in unison with God? Instead, there is not God and us but God is all in all. Existence is God. Sin, separation is not human being in the image of God at the fulfillment of creation.
      Eph 1:17-23, Col1:25-28, 1Cor 2:7-10

    • As far as I’m concerned and in reality my concern is of no concern to anyone in this world…you can wax poetic to your hearts content and even weave modern day cyber slang into it. But, the unbridled fact is that the GOD of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob made a covenant(s) only with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and no one else. Show me where this fact differs in scripture.
      J.

      • We must not discount or lose opportunity to share the revelation of God gifted abundantly yet limited only by our will, our faith, or our esteem. Humbly then, sharing is critical to realize Christ’s church and the kingdom of God. The apostles were sent out to preach the good news to Israel only, not the Samaritans or the gentiles.

        Mat 5:17-20, Mat 10:5-8, Deu 7:6-9, Exd 32:9, Exd 33:3, Exd 33:5, Deu 1:2, Deu 1:43, Deu 8:20, Deu 9:6, 2Ch 30:8, Jer 29:19, Psa 108:11, Mat 23:37-39, Act 7:51, 2Cr 3:14, Mat 12:18-21, Jhn 7:37-39, Mat 8:11-12,

        Jesus sent the disciples out only to Israel in honor of the covenants and promises with the fathers. He was rejected as prophesied yet accomplished the salvation of all.

        Psa 118:26, Mat 21:9, Mat 23:39, Mar 11:9-10, Luk 13:35, Luk 19:38, Jhn 12:13, Psa 118:21-26, Act 13:44-52, Mar 16:15-16, Jhn 14:13-23, Jhn 20:21-22, Act 19:2, 2Th 2:13-17

        Jerusalem, Israel, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob will eventually proclaim, “Blessed is He that comes in the Name of the Lord”. Rom 11:11-36

        • Jesus (yeshua) is Jewish, an Israeli. Did HE reject himself? The 12 were Jewish, Paul was Jewish. Did these reject HIM? I know of Jews who believe. Do they reject HIM? All these I mention were in the loins of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. I know the scripture that that states the rejection, so please don’t give me a list. Just think for yourself, how can the doctrine that GOD has replaced Israel with the Church be valid when throngs of Jewish people followed HIM? Gentiles don’t come into play until the 10th chapter of Acts and even them it was hard for the believing Jews to wrap their heads around the concept. Those who rejected him were the GOD the appointed leaders as put forth in Tanak. In Mat 15:14 KJV “Let them alone” The very same GOD who appointed the Jewish leaders was now removing them and placing the 12 in there place…the 12 were Jewish. They were aware of this so they argued about it, paraphrase – which would be the greatest in the coming Kingdom that Messiah would restore to Israel. The 12 were preparing for it that was why it was hard for them to comprehend His sacrificial death. I could go on.
          J.

          • Replacement theory does not comport with the bible. Anyone who has reasoned with the people of the covenant made with God through Moses at Mt. Horeb may be tempted to brush the dust off their shoes but scripture is clear. The promises are to and for Israel. Those who are indwelt with the Holy Ghost rejoice with the will of our God; All Israel will proclaim, “Blessed is He Who comes in the Name of the Lord”

        • Yes the nations (goyim) are graphed into the covenants the GOD of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob made with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob but we are an attachment, a rider. Show me in scripture a covenant made directly with those who are graphed in other than Jer 31:31-34 (Hebrew covenant) ratified by the Blood of the Lamb of God (Hebrew concept) the night before Yeshua (Hebrew Messiah) was sacrificed (Hebrew concept) during the Passover Seder (Hebrew ceremony)?
          J.

          • So does that make my salvation in less (Romans 1:16-17)? Because I was grafted in? Was it not a part of God’s plan all along to include Gentile believers (Ephesians 1:9-14)?

          • No Elijah, I stand on the same scriptural ground you do, we lose nothing by what I’m saying or asking, but we must realize there were no covenants made with “the church”, only Israel. This is in part the Replacement Theology that has been systematically translated into scripture. You must have heard of it? Do a study of the Greek word “Eklesia” in Act 19:32 KJV and ask why it is translated differently here? Because the “assembly” of people were a riotous mob. I been to a few where it would fit, but why not translate “eklasia” as church here? It must make you wonder at least? A similar thing happens to the Greek word synagōgē. This is in part of what I meant “The very mechanics of translating require interpretation by a sinful creation…. this is where error enters in.” The word has to be translated from one language to another. English is quite removed from the original language and concepts of the Hebrew.
            J.

          • Hi Jerry S,

            Here are some New Covenant scriptures for you. But the New Covenant is not based on the law or keeping the law, as so many Covenant and replacement theologists teach, or only with Israel. In Jesus, the middle wall of partition between Jew and gentile is broken down. (Ephesians 2:11-22, KJV). The New Covenant is based on Spiritual Life ratified by the shed spiritual blood of Jesus.

            Hbr 9:15 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance–now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

            Hbr 9:28 …so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many [not all] people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

            Hbr 12:24 …to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.

            Paul says, as he teaches the gentiles:

            1Cr 11:25 In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.”

            and

            2Cr 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant–not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

            God has made a new covenant, not only with Israel but will all those He will call through the faith of Jesus. It is not a covenant of the letter, but a covenant of the spirit which will have the spiritual laws written in our hearts by our new spirits.

            Yes, replacement theology has demonic origins, denying the covenant the Father made with the Hebrew fathers, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. God is Faithful, He will never break a promise.

            I love Him!

            Peace,

            Dee

          • Jerry thanks for your reply. I do not believe in replacement theory or that the church has replaced Israel. My original comment was based on the mention of errors in certain scriptures that were translated from the original tongues. My view of “men writing the bible” is that the Holy Spirit is the author of the Bible and used chosen men in the same way that I’m using this keyboard to write to you. I believe that a perfect God can use His imperfect creation perfectly. None of the greats of the bible were perfect but God use them all for His glory and His purpose was never hindered. My thought is that surely an almighty God could ensure that as His Word was translated, the meaning could be kept intact. I know others may disagree with that viewpoint and that is fine. I also believe that even if we have the Bible in the original languages that it was written in, understanding can only come by through the revealing of God Himself. Knowledge and interpretation of God’s Word can only come to a man through the power of the Holy Spirit. I agree with some points you have made but not all. I know that some things don’t always have a direct correlation from Hebrew to English or Greek to English but I also believe that with my diligent study and the revelation from the Holy Spirit, I can and have gain/ed an understanding even with using my English (KJV) bible. I would never worship a book. I just believe that an all powerful God can and will ensure that His word will be obtained by those who diligently seek Him. God bless!

  8. Brothers and sisters in Christ…
    sorry this got so long
    (please forgive my grammatical weakness)
    It’s wonderful how that with the push of some buttons and from the various sheepfolds were in that a whoosh to cyberspace allows us another moment to ‘self-examine’ ourselves (starting w/self of course) in the area of stewardship with the truth.

    As we study to show our selves approved and with a strong desire
    to rightly divide…our quest/zeal-will/should include the manners and customs, archeological etc. and the many historical
    records be it Josephus or the marvelous record of Ebershiem and of course bathed in prayer.

    As a baby I had zero to say what in the world are you doing
    to the arrangers of this moment. My Ukrainian father in conjunction with my Germanic mother in a dedicated fashion followed the manners and customs of their respected peoples; and once the event was over little was thought of until
    my age of 13 when I was thrust into the next ‘Oh my God moment’ of the custom of ‘confirmation’. Once again especially for me… my selfishness was focused on the cards and gifts not the gratefulness of our Lord’s shed blood. My selfishness is what really grew and continued to lead into a very out of controlled life. As a selfite it would take the next 17 years and the safety of God Almighty to find myself smack-dab in the middle of the bible belt. Imagine that even though I would actually walk by (in downtown Chicago) the Moody Bible Institute or in those teen years bus and train to the museum of science and industry where on the way (at a likely mission site) the sign of a neon cross with JESUS SAVES flashing it’s neon red…were right under my nose. The very first personal contact (a soul winner) came to me i the oil-feilds of Oklahoma which led me to Arkansas where a tract handed to me
    allowed to inner process of conviction to begin…I’m so very very thankful and because of mercy to you will begin to conclude o say this…we must never get so technically steeped
    forgetting our duty of one on one evangelism. i fail so very often at taking advantage of the moment made possible…is there a tract in your bag ‘as you go’ it may be some one’s beginning. Will I touch the untouchable as the first Jesus this ‘stinker’ may have felt in along time as well as how can I extend the Love of Jesus to father less and widows in the midst of their affliction? AS I go and you as well the reality
    is beyond the structural gathering places and then even within this comes the stranger…again this is only offered because
    as we look around us in the calamity of what has become the complexity to separate one another from each other and especially from God by our adversary hopefully will be the call to recommit our way both individually and collectively
    as we go…as we wait… for the shofar to sound and in that moment of a twinkling eye wha-la we will stand awaiting the next great moment in the very presence of our Lord…the reward of ‘well done’…is beyond our humanness.

    Thanks to all again for the encouragement to think on the word and I pray you will be enabled for your next Spirit led
    contact with a ‘someone’
    John 14:6
    Eph 5:11
    ovr-n-out
    shepard

  9. Wonderful to read everyone’s comments. Thank you Shepard, for sharing some of your history, before the insights your comments were throwing me off. Because the living word is pure and undefiled, with the Holy Spirit all can find eternal life — only by Christ’s finished work shedding His only perfect blood for us all. Our Father longs for all of us to understand, and has provided His Word in our Scriptures (bibles). This is foundational, however, only in His Spirit can these Words change hearts and make us salt and light. So by evangelism, you bear fruit. That is wonderful! But only Scripture feeds us and makes us fit to do works. Alone the Bible is both necessary and sufficient; not any customs/practices from any sort of traditions. I cling to mine like an astronaut their oxygen.

  10. Good and provoking thought. The direct question asked is: “Does belief in inerrancy lead to Bibliology”. To answer directly, no. However, just as another object, person, doctrine or occurrence, it can by the choice of the individual lead to Bibliology.
    We choose who we put first in our lives as Christians. Only the individual can honestly answer the question about their view of God’s Word; and only God can know if they are being honest about their view. Jesus himself said “for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.” It will be clear what you believe and who has the preeminence in your life when you begin to witness to others.
    Keep in mind, God is always first and is second to no one, but His word is perfect. He went as far to say in Psalm 138:2 “I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name.” Does that mean that when we worship it is greater than God; when we praise Him for his lovingkindness, it is greater? God forbid! God is not without worship, praise, truth or His [inerrant] word.

  11. Hebrews 5:12
    For when for the time you ought to be teachers you have need
    that one teach you again which be the first principles of the
    ORACLES of GOD and are become such as have need of milk and
    not of strong meat

    Hebrews 5:13
    For —EVERY ONE—that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness for he is a babe

    Hebrews 5:14
    But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age
    even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised
    to discern both good and evil

    John 6:54
    Whoso eateth MY FLESH AND DRINKETH MY BLOOD hath eternal life
    And I will raise —HIM UP—at the last day

    John 6:55
    FOR MY FLESH IS MEAT INDEED
    AND MY BLOOD IS DRINK INDEED

    Matthew 5:6
    Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after
    righteousness for they will be filled

    Matthew 5:10
    Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousnesses
    sake FOR —-THEIRS—- IS THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN

    Proverbs 8:7&8
    For MY mouth shall speak truth and wickedness is an
    abomination to MY lips
    (8)—ALL—the words of MY mouth are in righteousness
    There is nothing froward or perverse in them

    Romans 6:18
    Being then made free from sin
    You became the servants of righteousness

    Romans 6:18 NIV
    You have been set free from sin
    and become slaves to righteousness

    Romans 6:20
    For when you were the servants/slaves of sin
    You —WERE— free from righteousness

    Proverbs 8:20
    I lead in the way of righteousness
    In the midst of the paths of judgement

    Psalm 119:144
    The righteousness of thy testimonies is everlasting
    give me understanding and I shall live

    Matthew 6:33
    But seek ye first the kingdom of GOD
    and —-HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS—-and all these things shall be
    added unto you

    Romans 10:3
    For they being —IGNORANT—of GODS righteousness
    and going about to establish their own righteousness
    have NOT SUBMITTED TO GODS RIGHTEOUSNESS

    1 Corinthians 11:25
    After the same manner also HE TOOK THE CUP WHEN HE HAD SUPPED
    SAYING—-THIS IS THE CUP OF THE NEW TESTAMENT IN—MY BLOOD—
    THIS DO YE AS OFT AS YOU DRINK IT IN REMEMBRANCE OF ME

    Psalm 116:13
    I will take the cup of salvation
    and call upon the name of the LORD

    LOVING MY BOTHER AND MY FATHER
    PRAYING ALWAYS IN JESUS NAME

    • Yes Steve,
      2Cr 5:21 For he hath made him [to be] sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

  12. Bibliolatry is itself an “error” that does not come from believing a doctrine of “inerrancy” about the Word of God.
    It simply comes, as all error does, from following one’s own way (or the ways of other men) versus following all that the Word of God teaches as illuminated to us by the power of the Holy Spirit.
    There is only ONE God. Thus there can be only ONE Holy Spirit of God, and also only ONE Word of God made flesh: Jesus.
    IF we follow the Spirit of God not only to” hear” but to “do”what the Word of God tells us to do (in both Old and New Testament), we will please God. We will not walk in error. But we often do not take time to be filled with His Spirit; thus we do not have an intimate relationship with THE WORD MADE FLESH:Jesus.
    Without a complete surrender of ourselves to Jesus as our Savior AND Lord (by faith), without a continual filling of the Holy Spirit through whom we have the resurrection (born-again) power to walk as ONE with Jesus in complete obedience to the Father (through grace), we will never please God. We will have only a “form of godliness, denying the power thereof.” It is the power of God that keeps us from sin and error. There is no other way.
    Self-deception, however, knows many ways. To paraphrase a line from an excellent book titled “I Told Me So: Self-Deception and the Christian Believer” by Greg A. Ten Elshof:
    “The problem with self-deception is that if I am deceived it would seem to me (as it does actually seem to me) that I am not.”
    One God = One Spirit = One Way, One Life, One Truth.
    No error possible.

  13. What I have learned over the years is that the Bible is not of any private interpretation. In other words, it was inspired by the Holy Spirit to ‘sinful’ men. From the time in the Garden of Eden, God said He would put enmity between the woman and her seed, and He shall bruise Satan’s heal. Jesus came in the trust that what was prophesied by ‘sinful’ man, was accurate. So Jesus fulfilled all prophecy.

    Each of us can read one particular Scripture, and each one will receive a different understanding. It is as individual as the person reading it, and where each particular person’s need is at the time.

    Jesus said, I am my Father are One and the Same. God’s Will is His Word.

    I’ve used various translations, not just the KJV, because often times, the italicized words ms-direct the meaning.

    The Hebrew and Greek languages are limited in their meanings because their alphabet is much shorter than the English language. The translator’s struggled to find accurate words to interpret the writings. So the main thing is.. to take several translations, and read the wording used, and you can grasp the meaning with the help of Holy Spirit.

    What some religions have done is write their own Bibles, and have made man-inspired doctrines and creeds, and have taken God’s Word out of context.

    I, too; came out of Mormonism in 1983, and I’m so Thankful that I now know the Truth.

    Blessings!

    • 2 Peter 1:19-21

      19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
      20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
      21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

      And by the way, we are Abraham’s seed and heirs according to the Promise! If anyone thinks that Abraham’s Coveant was just for him and a few, then you do not understand God’s purpose for Abraham taking his only son Isaac to sacrifice him according to God’s command. It was a type and shadow of Jesus coming as our Sacrifice. Jesus couldn’t have come if Abraham had not been obedient to God’s command. Read that story. Abraham was obedient to God’s command even if it meant actually killing Isaac on the Altar. Abraham’s faith was accounted unto him as ‘righteousness’, and God provided the Lamb, and Abraham and Isaac both came back down that mountain. Also need to read Deuteronomy 28. That is the Covenant of Abraham!

    • One last comment… when I said ‘sinful’ men.. that was to say except for the Twelve Disciples, the prophets of Old, were not Born Again; but they were obedient to God’s Voice. Since they were under the Old Covenant, none of them could be Born Again, until after Jesus completed His work on the Cross; therefore they were under Adam’s sin-nature as we were until we got Born Again (Saved).

      Abraham was under the Old Covenant, but he represents our physical needs in wealth and riches, and Jesus is our Spiritual needs. Jesus came to us as a physical man, and was at all points tempted as we are, yet He was without sin because He was not born out of a man’s seed, but by the Holy Spirit.

      We are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the Promise made to Abraham; which was a blood-sworn oath between God an Abraham. Selah!

  15. Whether the doctrine of inerrancy is the cause or not there is no question that some people worship the Bible without worshipping the God of the Bible. How can the Bible be anything but inerrant and still contain the truth about God and the way of salvation?
    But it can most certainly be misapplied, deliberately and through lack of rightly dividing the word of truth. It is the written revelation of God but without a relationship with the Living God
    it is no help to those who read it and think that reading alone without obeying will do them any good.

  16. FATHER WHAT DO YOUR WORDS STAND FOR AND PROVIDE FOR US

    JESUS CHRIST—TRUTH—LOVE—BLOOD—SPIRIT—WISDOM—UNDERSTANDING—KNOWLEDGE—LIGHT—RIGHTEOUSNESS—HOLINESS—GODLINESS—GOODNESS—KINDNESS—WATER—FOOD—MEAT—GRACE—LIFE—PURENESS—PROFIT—ETERNAL LIFE—INSIGHT—WORKS—INSTRUCTION—TESTIMONY—FRUIT—BREAD—COMMANDMENTS—SALVATION—SALVATION—SALVATION

    ———–THE MEANS BY WHICH WE ARE TO WORSHIP YOU————

    Isaiah 2:22
    Cease ye from man whose breath is in his nostrils
    For wherein is he to be accounted of

    Romans 2:5
    But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgement of GOD

    Romans 2:6
    WHO WILL RENDER TO EVERY MAN ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS

    Romans 2:7
    To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honor and immortality eternal life

    Romans 2:8
    But unto them that are contentious
    AND DO NOT OBEY THE TRUTH—BUT OBEY UNRIGHTEOUSNESS—
    INDIGNATION AND WRATH

    Romans 2:9
    Tribulation and anguish upon EVERY SOUL OF MAN THAT DOETH EVIL
    of the Jew first and also of the Gentile

    John 14:15
    If you love ME keep MY commandments

    John 21:15
    So when they had dined JESUS saith to Simon Peter
    Simon son of Jonas lovest thou ME more than these
    He saith unto HIM Yea LORD thou knowest that I love thee
    HE saith unto him—FEED MY LAMBS—

    John 21:16
    HE saith unto him again the second time
    Simon son of Jonas lovest thou ME
    Yea LORD thou knowest that I love thee
    HE saith unto him—FEED MY SHEEP—

    John 21:17
    HE saith unto him the third time
    Simon son of Jonas lovest thou ME
    Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time
    lovest thou ME and he said unto HIM
    LORD thou knowest all things thou knowest that I love thee
    JESUS saith unto him—FEED MY SHEEP—

    2 Thessalonians 2:10
    And with all deceiveableness of unrighteousness in them that perish
    because they received not the love of the truth
    that they might be saved

    Mark 8:35
    For whosoever will save his life shall lose it
    But whosoever shall lose his life for MY sake and the gospels
    The same shall save it

    Acts 10:34
    Then Peter opened his mouth and said
    of a truth I perceive that GOD IS NO RESPECTER of persons

    Acts 10:35
    But in every nation he that feareth HIM and worketh
    righteousness is accepted with HIM

    Romans 2:11
    For there is no respect of persons with GOD

    John 14:6
    Jesus saith unto him
    I am the way
    the truth
    and the life
    No man cometh to the FATHER but by ME

    AMEN LORD JESUS THANK YOU AND THANK YOU FATHER

  17. I believe the comments here miss the point entirely, setting up “straw men” to create a religious debate. To rephrase the question: Does a DOCTRINE proclaiming an inerrant or infallible scriptural document inspired by a living God, cause people to worship the DOCUMENT rather than God? Come on people. THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION IS NO!! The issue is not about translations or mistranslations and deceptions of the document throughout history, but the worship of a created document. It is the total depravity of man, the wickedness of man’s heart, his inherited Adamic human nature, that causes man to worship anything other than God (the triune Godhead–Father, Christ the Son and the Holy Ghost).

    Jesus said: Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life. I receive not honour from men. John 5:39-41 KJV

    Because Christianity degenerated into a religion (compare to Judaism, Islam, and other religions with printed guidelines and aesthetic worship programs), since early on, about 150 A.D. and solidified its “church” reinterpretation through the Nicene and subsequent Roman Catholic and protestant counsels and reformations, most people are to this day inducted into it having no living knowledge of a living God. Usually, affirmation, knowledge and study of a creed is all that is required to join a “church” or become one of its leaders. Vain philosophy and soulish interpretations must, of necessity, demand the use of the bible as the method and standard of “conversion”–touch not, taste not, etc.

    God is Sovereign! There is eternal life in no one but God, a Life given to God’s elect through Jesus Christ since before there was sin to be saved from, for God’s purposes. Jesus told us in the scripture above that there is no life in the scriptures. The Holy Spirit, through Paul the Apostle, tells us that the God-breathed scriptures have a purpose (2 Tim 3;16)–understood as sanctification of the saints–but they do not give Life! Jesus tells us the scriptures point to where Life can be obtained–from Him, Jesus Christ, the Living God! Think about this for a minute. If eternal life and the worship of God could be obtained based on how man can translate, interpret and intellectually understand the bible (soul), would there be a need for redemption in Jesus?

    God is a Spirit. He is the Father of spirits. The spirit of man is the only part made in the image of God, now tarnished and dead through sin. Man can only worship God from a human spirit made alive, a new creation, born from above by God. (John 3; 2 Cor 5) Everyone is not born again and a new creature, and therefore cannot, nor wants to, worship the true God. Hence idolatry, or bibli- whatever. Shouldn’t we know this?

    • I absolutely agree with much o what you said, many people rely on  creeds. But forgive me if I am misunderstanding you, you said that “if eternal and the worship of God could be obtained based on how a man can translate, interpret and intellectually understand the bible then there would be no need for redemption in Christ ” it seems like your saying that a man can pretty much believe what he wants?

      • Hi Malik,

        You miss the Lord’s point. He is speaking about spiritual life, not mental agreement. Jesus said the scriptures speak of, point to, or teach the doctrine which tells us where to obtain life–in Him–but His Father gives it. Grace through faith is a gift of God. He also told us that all that the Father has given Him will not be lost, including all those that will believe on Him by the word of His disciples (you and me!). Jesus does not pray for the world. John 17.

        Actually, while that was not focus, the scriptures do teach that man can, and pretty much does, believe whatever he wants. The human heart(soul) is deceitful and desperately wicked, totally depraved. (Jeremiah 17:9; Matthew 15:19, Mark 17:21, more) The evidence of that truth starts with Adam and continues with humanity’s fellowship with satan, the world’s systems and idolatry.

        It is God who reaches in (down!?), gives man the faith to believe the Truth to receive redemption through the blood of Christ. God, by using His preferred power method of the preaching of the good news, effects this. (Romans 1:16) Again, the eternal life that is in Christ (not in the bible), must received from God first–it is a gift of God, at His choosing, for His eternal purposes, not man’s choosing. The origin and order of salvation is clearly evident throughout scripture. The soul (heart) of man cannot be renewed without a newly created human spirit to guide it, spiritually trained by the Holy Spirit. The scriptures are used by the Holy Spirit for the sanctification, training up and maturing of the saints, not the world.

        Dee

    • Dee~

      You make a lot of good points, but I have to take exception to your paragraph beginning with the statement beginning with “Because Christianity degenerated into a religion,….” There have been many great and false Christian religions throughout history, the Roman Catholic Church being the mother of them all, but Christianity did not degenerate into anything. In Matthew 16:18, Christ clearly says, “And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.” In other words, nothing ever has and nothing ever will bring Christ’s church to an end on Earth.

      Have a blessed day~
      Barbara

      • Hi Barbara,

        I believe I may have phrased the beginning of that paragraph awkwardly more and assumed that there was knowledge of the scriptural background of these issues. However, the substance is still what I mean. I do not want to go outside of scripture to speak of what the Holy Spirit is teaching us.

        Earlier on this blog, there was a discussion about the error in the translation of the Greek word “ekklesia”, (meaning “the called out from” or assembly, in different contexts), into the English word “church”, irrespective of its original contextual meanings. It was a good study. I can only judge an uninspired motive behind the translator’s obscuring God’s perspective of what it is He means by ekklesia, since the translations began in earnest after the “church systems” were already solidified, and divisions were already in play. I say obscure or coverup because the use of the word today does not point to the spiritual nature of the body of Jesus the Anointed as a spiritual, living organism. It is a religious word (from the Old English word “kirk” referring to a building) having religious, secular, organizational connotations. Once the ball started rolling, “intellectual theologians” jumped on the band wagon and vainly built churches and church doctrine. The word still refers to a physical building. Historically and currently, most churches do not require a “christian” to be actually born from above!

        The only way we can understand God’s meaning of the Greek word behind “church” (ekklesia), including the quotation you made from Jesus, is to look at Paul’s gospel. Remember, Jesus was talking about His ekklesia to come, to be built by revelation on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Himself as the chief cornerstone. Hallelujah!! Peter in Acts 7 talks about the “ekklesia in the wilderness, referring to the called out from among the gentiles, the Jewish nation, not the religious church of modern times! The resurrected, glorified Jesus revealed only to Paul (Ephesians 3:3 KJV), the meaning of Jesus’ body, the ekklesia (translated church), as the body of Christ and the doctrine (gospel) of grace. The saints, being the spiritual body of Christ, was a mystery (secret) hid in God. (Ephesians 5:29-32 KJV) And Paul taught the doctrine of grace to Peter in his rebuke of him in Galatians.

        Secondly, let me say very boldly that the 1st century disciples and apostles initially, were mostly Jewish disciples and they did not ever call themselves Christians or preach and teach about following a religion called Christianity, or Judaism, or any religion at all, like the “Christians” do today. Paul, Peter, John, etc., were not Christians! The disciples referred to themselves as “followers of the way”, which is Who Jesus called Himself. (Prayerfully read these verses: John 14:4-6; Acts 9:2; 16:7; 18:25,26; 19:9,23; 22:4; 24:14,22; Romans 3:17; Hebrews 9:8; 10:20; 2Peter 2:2, 21). They also called themselves saints, believers, brethren, sons of God, etc.

        Like other words in the translations from the Received Texts, and the adulterated Westcott Hort playbook for gentiles, many words are not translated from the Greek into English properly (research the word “Easter”.) The Greek meaning of the word “Christos” is “Anointed”, taken from the Hebrew meaning Messiah. The word christian, is still untranslated as “follower of Christ”. It should read “follower of the anointed”, or “follower of the Messiah”. The use of the words anointed or Messiah carries all the full weight of the Old Testament prophecies. The word Christ does not, must be explained and leaves lots of room for interpretation.

        It was the unbelieving Jews and gentiles who used the Greek word christianos, in derision. The Jews understood the gentiles use of the word “christianos” to mean “followers of the Messiah, the anointed or the Way”. And Peter, the apostle to the Jews, admonished the disciples not to be offended by the taunts, knowing the truth of what was being referred to. (1 Peter 4:16) Those saints who call themselves Christians now have the dilemma of separating and distinguishing themselves from “other” so-called Christians who are religious idolators. Talk about confusion. God is not the author of that stuff. 1 Corinthians 14:33.

        The number of times (3x) the word is used in scripture does not legitimize its use as the name of a religion for Christians! We must look at the contextual use to get at the truth, which is deeply buried. If you read the account of King Agrippa’s conversation with Paul, you can see that the word christian is an artificially backdated word used, again obscuring the meaning, since Paul is asking Agrippa, a Jew, whether he believes the prophets concerning the Messiah and the hope of Israel! Agrippa’s response is that he is almost persuaded to become a “follower of the Messiah”! So why did the translators throw in an untranslated word with no contextual meaning? Hmmm. I smell a fox in the hen house. Thank the Lord that He has given his sons (and daughters!) the Holy Spirit, an anointing, knowing the wickedness of human hearts.

        1John 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

        Amen.

        • If I may tag-on here and share what I’ve learned in my search to know the Hebrew Messiah better. To me, it seems as a gentile believer it is best to work starting from the Hebrew in a forward direction instead of from the English in a backwards direction. What we believe in are Hebrew concepts and beliefs thousands of years from where we gentiles live out our biblical lives today. The meaning of the Hebrew words qahal and `edah are what is being referred to by the NT writers when using the Greek words ekklēsia and synagogue respectively. In the LXX these two Greek words were chosen in translation to their Hebrew compliments. You can find these words by doing a search of the Hebrew for our English words assembly and congregation. Why does this even matter? Good question, answer: These are Hebrew concepts and beliefs, not American, English, Latin, Greek or any other culture that the Good News has been spread these last two thousand years. Understanding the backdrop of the times these words were written is critical for our understanding of them today and critical in ensuring false doctrines are exposed. Do a study of what these two Hebrew words would mean to a Jew. It’s a safe bet that Yeshua, the ambassadors and Shaul thought of them the same way. I’ll save what I’ve learned of the word Christian for another time. Signing off, it is getting late on the right coast.
          J.

          • Hi Jerry,

            I appreciate your research! I have learned that if we put our research before the Holy Spirit for God’s spiritual interpretation, we will not get hung up on the letter of the word or words, but will live in the spirit of it. That is where life is, in Jesus. Remember, the scriptures always point to Jesus! John 5:39, 40

            Barbara quoted the Lord’s revelation in Matthew 16:18 where He proclaimed the basis, foundation for HIS ekklesia (translated church). Jesus’ declaration transcended human thought, and was a total break from the “types and shadows” of the OT Law (and its Jewishness). His church was not to be built upon the old Jewish religious concepts of synagogue, assembly and congregation, which was developed and based in the Old Testament experience with God.

            Jesus was talking about building His spiritual body made of an entirely new human species (new creatures, 2 Corinthians 5:17), based in a spiritual (not mystical) connection to His Spirit of Life!! This is why He appeared in His Glorified body and preached this newness to Paul, whose extensive experience with the Old needed to be cast down as death dealing. (Paul was told that the law was spiritual but is was weak, could not give life, because of the sinful flesh of man.) Paul was one of the able minister of the new testament revelations of the truth. He was a Jew but he didn’t teach Jewish customs or law as a means of achieving Life! He fervently walked as an ambassador of Jesus, set upon new foundations.

            We must learn how to function as Christ’s spiritual body by the Holy Spirit, not by cloning dead religious organizations.

            Grace and Peace

          • Well hello to you Dee! With all the conversation happening I hope you see this. Thanks for responding in turn, I do enjoy these discussions about Yeshua. Your thoughts are quite interesting and similar to a Pauline Doctrine expressed by a certain Eric who I’ve conversed with in the Blog. I do believe I understand your overarching point that as believers we are the living Temple in which the Spirit of GOD dwells and it is there that we live and move and have our being moment to moment of our lives. (Now comes the but)….But what you and Eric describe is a little metaphysical for my section of the “assembly” lets say. When it comes to any “doctrine” I believe it is best to have the Terms and Parties clearly spelled out as in Jer 31:31-34 KJV along with the other covenants the GOD of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob made with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. I see the scripture you reference and understand your thoughts, but it leaves me open ended and wondering if it’s me that missing something. Like I told Eric, I take the word for what it plainly says.

            Blessings to you though, I enjoy what you have to say and look forward to reading more of it.

            J.

          • Hello again to you Jerry S,

            Yes, this is a hot blog dealing with belief in the sovereignty of God, His Word as His Light, the origin of spiritual life and idolatry. The scriptural exhortations are yummy!

            First, let me be clear that I do not deal or delve in the metaphysical or mystical. Both perspectives are from human soulish ideas resulting in vain philosophy (Colossians 2:8, KJV). And neither should you! As you said, you take the word for what it plainly says. My perspective is God’s perspective, spiritual. Not because I am anything or so smart or without flaws, but because by faith from God, I believe the scriptures, live in them and judge by them with the help of the Holy Spirit. Just wanted to clarify terms, as you requested. LOL!

            Secondly, I wrote to you earlier in the blog concerning your quest for information and understanding of a New Covenant, other than the one God made with Israel, but with all the conversation it got buried. Here it is again. I will also put it at the end of the blog in case you don’t get back here! I hope it will help to address that open-ended questions you have.

            Grace and Peace

            August 28, 2012 at 10:23 am #

            Hi Jerry S,

            Here are some New Covenant scriptures for you. But the New Covenant is not based on the law or keeping the law, as so many Covenant and replacement theologists teach, or only with Israel. In Jesus, the middle wall of partition between Jew and gentile is broken down. (Ephesians 2:11-22, KJV). The New Covenant is based on Spiritual Life ratified by the shed spiritual blood of Jesus.

            Hbr 9:15 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance–now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

            Hbr 9:28 …so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many [not all] people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

            Hbr 12:24 …to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.

            Paul says, as he teaches the gentiles:

            1Cr 11:25 In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.”

            and

            2Cr 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant–not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

            God has made a new covenant, not only with Israel but will all those He will call through the faith of Jesus. It is not a covenant of the letter, but a covenant of the spirit which will have the spiritual laws written in our hearts by our new spirits.

            Yes, replacement theology has demonic origins, denying the covenant the Father made with the Hebrew fathers, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. God is Faithful, He will never break a promise.

            I love Him!

            Peace,

            Dee

        • Dee~

          Thank you for clarifying what you meant. While I do agree that studying the meaning behind the Greek and Hebrew words is an important part of our growth in the Word, I disagree, if I correctly understand your argument, that believers aren’t fully grasping the meaning of what Christ, the Apostles, and the writers of biblical canon were teaching because the words are different. I have attended several Christian denominations, and in each one, the meaning of the original languages is taught alongside the English translation although I would like to see more of it done. We know the original meaning of the word “ekklesia” and know that although buildings and denominations are referred to as “churches” that this word refers to believers, that they are the “called-out ones” who are no longer of the world but have been set apart, as the body of Christ, for God’s will, purpose, and good pleasure.

          You wrote, “I can only judge an uninspired motive behind the translator’s obscuring God’s perspective of what it is He means by ekklesia, since the translations began in earnest after the ‘church systems’ were already solidified, and divisions were already in play.” With all due respect, “divisions” are not a by-product of “church systems;” they’ve been around since day one. As Paul said, “Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and [that] there be no divisions among you; but [that] ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them [which are of the house] of Chloe, that there are contentions among you. Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul” (I Cor. 10-13)? Are there divisions in the body of Christ? There absolutely are, but they aren’t the result of not understanding the Greek or Hebrew behind our English words; they are the result of not seeking first the kingdom of God and His righteousness (Matt. 6:33), of being hearers of the Word and not a doers (James 1:23-25), of being double minded (James 4:8), and of not growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus Christ (II Pet. 3:18).

          When you write that “Historically and currently, most churches do not require a ‘christian’ to be actually born from above,” to what churches are you referring? I have not studied each of what must be hundreds, if not thousands, of groups that consider themselves Christian, but it appears from the studying I have done that most churches, historically and currently, very much believe in being born again although, for many of them, it is being born again into their denomination and not into the body of Christ although the distinction eludes them.

          You wrote, “Those saints who call themselves Christians now have the dilemma of separating and distinguishing themselves from ‘other’ so-called Christians who are religious idolators. Talk about confusion. God is not the author of that stuff.”* You are right when you say that God is not the author of confusion, but there is no “dilemma of separating and distinguishing themselves” merely because of what they are called as you suggest and for three reasons. The first is that the very definition of “Christian” is one who adheres to or follows Christ and this term is just a synonym for the phrase “followers of the way” as it relates to Christ Who is The Way. In addition, every Christian book, tape, radio/TV program, retreat, class, Bible study, and church that I have ever read, listened to, or attended, respectively, has always used the words “saints, believers, brethren, sons of God” to define themselves, so there is no confusion in this regard. Secondly, nowhere does Scripture say that believers must refer to themselves by any specific title (e.g. “followers of the way”) in order to distinguish themselves or to avoid confusion. On the contrary, believers are told exactly how to separate and distinguish themselves from “other so-called Christians who are religious idolators”: it is by their fruits (Matt. 7:20), by their works (Jam. 2:18), and by the fruit of the Spirit (Gal. 5:22-23). All things considered, true believers are identified by what they think (believe), what they say, and what they do. In other words, they follow the first and second greatest commandments (Mk. 12:29-31). The third reason stems from reason two. As we both know, there are numerous groups that call themselves Christian that aren’t. This was the case in the time of Christ, it was the case throughout history, and it is the case today. As with anything counterfeit, the first deception comes through the name being used because that is the shortest route to understanding what something is, or supposes itself to be, but it doesn’t matter what the specific name being used is, only that it is the same as the authentic group. In other words, there are psedo-Christian groups because believers in Christ are called Christians. If believers in Christ were called “followers of the way,” as you suggest, then there would be pseudo-followers of the way.

          *If anything, the one shortcoming of Christianity with regard to this topic is that it doesn’t do enough to contend for the faith (Jude 1:3), that it doesn’t expose the theological works of darkness (II Tim. 4:2-5). It is my prayer that this is one of the results of this site, that the truth of God’s Word will go forth as He intended, “profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness” (II Tim. 3:16b).

          Again, I appreciate your responding. I need to finish a response to someone else, but if you would like to continue with this dialogue in a few days, I would be happy to.

          Yours in Christ~
          Barbara

          • Hi Barbara,

            You said, “I disagree, if I correctly understand your argument, that believers aren’t fully grasping the meaning of what Christ, the Apostles, and the writers of biblical canon were teaching because the words are different.”

            You have given us a perfect example of a “straw man” (look it up). You have set up your own premises to argue against. It is not an honesty inquiry. You know exactly what I have clearly said! No, you have not correctly understood my exhortations. Nowhere on any page of this blog have I said such things. I challenge you to find it!!

            For clarification and to dispel any confusion for anyone else reading this, I was talking about the importance of spiritually understanding what Jesus meant by church (ekklesia), as opposed to the soulish, vain misconceptions of man’s interpretation today and historically, which is leading God’s people astray.
            Barbara, read Revelations and especially the first 3 chapters contrasting the natural and spiritual church.

            You also said in response: “it appears from the studying I have done that most churches, historically and currently, very much believe in being born again although, for many of them, it is being born again into their denomination and not into the body of Christ although the distinction eludes them.”

            Among other disagreements, this response is double-minded confusion, debate and argumentative. We are told we should not handle the word of God deceitfully. (2 Corinthians 4:2, KJV) This is also not an honest response.

            I am sorry. I will not continue this discussion with you.

            Grace and the Peace of God to you,

            Dee

          • Dee~

            Well, okay. I certainly don’t know what I wrote that has angered you so much. I’m sorry that you have chosen not to address my questions and comments because they were not dishonest or argumentative. I was just responding to your comments, and there is not one mean-spirited comment in the entire post. In addition, it is precisely because I prefaced my statement with “If I understand your argument” that illustrates that it wasn’t a fallacy in argument. I certainly didn’t mean to offend you.

            Barbara

          • Hi Barbara LeFevre,

            Again, your response is disingenuous (look it up), but I do accept your apology. Let me also say to you that I am not angry or offended with you or anyone here. I believe the Holy Spirit when He shows me, and tells me:

            2Ti 2:23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

            I will not continue discussing this issue with you. It is off topic. But I hope we can share our understandings of God’s perspective in more sincere conversation. (1Peter 2:2 KJV)

            Grace and God’s Peace

            Dee

  18. WORDS ADDITIONALLY:
    THE GOSPEL—TREASURE—HOPE—COUNSEL—COMFORT—PROMISES
    DAMNATION—JUDGEMENT—CONDEMNATION—ETERNAL FIRE

    Matthew 4:4
    But HE answered and said
    It is written man MAN SHALL NOT LIVE BY BREAD ALONE BUT
    BY EVERY WORD THAT PROCEEDETH OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD

    Revelation 19:10
    And I fell at his feet to worship him and he said unto me
    see thou do it not I am thy fellowservant and of thy brethren
    that have the testimony of JESUS
    WORSHIP GOD FOR THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS IS THE SPIRIT OF PROPHECY

    Revelation 22:18
    For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the
    prophecy of this book
    —IF—any man shall add unto these things GOD shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book

    Revelation 22:19
    And—IF—any man shall take away from the words of this book
    GOD SHALL TAKE AWAY HIS PART OUT OF THE BOOK OF LIFE AND OUT OF THE HOLY CITY AND FROM THE THINGS THAT ARE WRITTEN IN THIS BOOK

    Hebrews 2:1
    Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard lest at any time we should let them slip

    Ezekiel 24:14
    I THE LORD have spoken it it shall come to pass and I will do it
    I will not go back neither will I spare neither will I repent
    According to thy ways and according to thy doings shall they judge thee SAITH THE LORD GOD

    Ezekiel 36:36
    Then the heathen that are left round about you shall know that I THE LORD build the ruined places and plant that that was desolate I THE LORD HAVE SPOKEN IT AND I WILL DO IT

    HELP US O LORD TO GIVE PRAISE UNTO YOU

  19. All of this debate is just what Satan loves to see – people professing to be Christians arguing about God’s word (the Bible). I won’t add to the list of Biblical quotations because people can dip in and out as they please to prove their (own) point.
    I will quote our teacher who says, “When the meaning isn’t clear at first, let Scripture interpret Scripture” and “The Bible doesn’t tell us everything there is to know, but it does tell us everything we need to know.”
    Scripture is God’s way of communicating with us, His revelation of Who He is; it is His promise to us of a Redeemer (OT), the fulfillment of that promise (Jesus) and what we should do in light of this (go and tell the nations). Within that He reveals to us the true nature of man (fallen and sinful) and shows us the standard by which He judges us (Jesus). He gives us hope and inspiration that, despite that nature, He can change us by living within us (the Holy Spirit) once we have allowed Him residence (born again).
    It is no coincidence that Jesus is the Word because the whole of Scripture points to Him, and points us to Him.
    Therefore, we should regard the Bible as inerrant (of course – as is obvious the more one reads and studies it) because it shows us God in all His glory. However we should worship the One that it is about, Jesus.
    There is no doubt that error has been introduced in various translations but, without exception, the erroneous ones have led to sects which are not Christians (ie Jehovah’s Witnesses. Mormons, Christadelphians etc etc). Having said that, the KJV is also accepted by some of these sects; they just have a mind-set that twists the truth to fit what they want to believe – that Jesus is not God.
    I pray that those of us who have the Holy Spirit indwelling us will hold firmly to the Rock, feed on His Word, believe His Truth, spread His Gospel and stop arguing with each other about the Bible’s inerrancy.

    • We are given examples within biblical text to help us negotiate our apprenticeship lives. 1Cr 10:6-11
      These blogs are saints reasoning together that mirror doubts and lessons experienced by apostles and disciples in scripture. Act 20:32, 2Cr 4:2-18 A testament is not, “his story”. The testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

    • With all love allow me to say this to your reply. You wrote – “the erroneous ones have led to sects”, I totally agree. Would it not then behoove us to expose these errors in translation so all cane be aware? A great deal of NT scripture warns us of false doctrine that we should always be vigilant in exposing, no matter what the cost. Yeshua exposed much of the Jewish leader’s motives and it cost HIM HIS life, we can expect no less. On your point of arguing, it is not unscriptural though it may be unchristian. As I mention here, the arguments Yeshua had exposing the Jewish leaders of HIS day’s motives (selfishness) were quite heated, but look where HE has brought us from it. Argument is not necessarily a bad thing.
      J.

      • Jerry,

        You said: “On your point of arguing, it is not unscriptural though it may be unchristian.”

        I love your honest, direct, bold, fearlessness. LOL! You remind me of Apollos in Acts 18.

        Your point seems to suggest that there is a difference between the two perspectives, with which, I do concur! So, which approach do you believe is based in the tree of life, and which is based in the tree of the knowledge of good and evil!?

        In Yeshua!

    • Hi MA,

      The Holy Spirit, through the Lord’s brother Jude tells us

      Jud 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort [you] that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

      And they did that without the “New” Testament bible in hand and Strong’s Concordance! LOL! Unfortunately, in these last and very evil days, we are told that knowledge will increase. That means vain philosophy and soulish intellectual thinking will muddy the waters of truth.

      You shouldn’t get frustrated over what this will look like to the devil, unbelievers or religious unsaved Christians. They can’t understand the spiritual truth, the mind of Christ or God’s perspective, and we can’t know who they are!! The preaching and teaching of the good news of God’s grace (gospel)is the Power of God for salvation.

      You be sure to make your calling and election sure. By all means, weigh in with what you know by the Spirit of God. Exhortation and edification is part of God’s prescription for spiritual growth.

      His and yours, by His Love,

      Dee

  20. Great article.
    I will say that it was not until I took the bible as a document that could in fact be trusted that I found I could commit myself to God without reservation.
    I needed to know that I could depend on him to do what he said he’d do. If the bible is a book that cannot be trusted, and especially since I’m not a mind reader– how could I depend on God to actually do what he claimed?
    I’ve heard agnostics, and religionists claim this idea of “bibliotry”, and I wondered…. but at a given point, I realized– why could not the creator of the universe who was sovereign, and who would bring all things under his control, while allowing all freedom of choice to all parties, without ever once violating their free will, actually preserve the integrity of the document we call– the bible.

    So, to those who you who do have a hard time with this concept of biblical inerrancy– I have to wonder– who is this God you trust yourselves to? How do you know… I mean– REALLY KNOW– he’s actually trustworthy, if the book that’s claimed to be His, is in fact– actually his, if he cannot ensure the integrity of the book?
    If you cannot trust God to maintain the integrity of the bible, then God’s word literally could be any one of a thousand religious documents as the non-believing world claims. At which point– we cannot trust that Jesus is who he claims to be– because we don’t know the documents are actually trustworthy….

  21. Separation is the key to the adverary’s success against us or against any human.

    Separation with Our Great LORD “YHWH” If we get separated we can’t hear our shepherd and if we can’t hear our shepherd we can get lost.

    If we as sheep/christians get lost we will get devoured. What type of meal we are varies but we will be eaten. Sometimes slowly.

    It’s not about debate it’s about unity & love. I am proven wrong alot but Jesus holds the rudder to my boat so I don’t worry I just absorb and learn from each right and wrong move, it’s how he teaches us. The Word prove that in all the tests His people encountered in it, and all the tests we each encounter every single day we live.

    I said that to say this.

    To me, and I have used many different translations of the Word in my walk and have found, the Bible, any Bible, any version of the Bible is covered and sanctified by GOD ALMIGHTY.

    To protect the eyes that read it.

    It is His Word provided to His people. It is His Written Word.

    I believe in the Power Of Jesus provided us through The Holy Spirit to protect those who love Him out weighs our ability to understand or see. Again if we yield to His Words.

    He will protect our understanding of everything we read if we yield to Him and allow Him to do so. I have asked for eyes to see and know Him.

    If I have Love, Faith, and Seek Him with all my Heart He says I will find Him, and I did and so have all of you if you believe His Word and Love Him.

    He walked each of us down a path to this very moment and everyone of our paths differ but we all ended up here right now.

    He did that the GOD that Can and the God who loves you. The one who won all those battles for David and many others of the OT. The One who conquered death itself.

    He gave each of us eyes to see Him in a very personal way and a very different way.

    The way each of us who was created in His image need.

    The way He created us to need.

    Every child has different needs and He fullfills them. In His Way, not ours.

    I believe He does that so we each feel special and precious when He works in our personal behalf.

    When I open my Bible each day I trust I land or open it exactly where the Holy Spirit wants me to land and I receive the food the LORD chose for me to have today.

    Sometimes He says where to go, sometimes it’s a journey.

    That food nurishes me completely for the day at hand or answers the needs I have.

    I have built a rock solid foundation of who my Father is with His Word and His Holy Spirit.

    Even with many diffrent versions used based on my walk.
    My Faith is now not moveable by man.

    Through every story, every word in the Bible I have grown and continue to grow in my personal relationship with my Daddy, My Husband, and My Helper.

    I believe in it’s inerracy because I believe the GOD that created it in the first place is big enough to protect His child that Seeks Him and Loves Him from any in accurate translation.

    I don’t worship the Bible because of its inerracy it helped me get to know my Daddy and I worship Him because of it’s inerracy and the wisdom and Knowledge I have found there.

    It helped create my foundation of Truth based on His Love and Just Behavior in it. It is His Truth.

    I also believe that in seeking Wisdom and Knowledge you must not Love those things more than you Love your GOD. it might lead to Wisdom and Knowledge Worship which in effect could lead to Bible worship instead of God.

    I believe that a personal intimate relationship with Jesus ” His Word” YHWH “Our Creator” and the Holy Spirit ” Our Teacher” protects us no matter what if we yield to his voice and Trust Him.

    He is big enough and has proven over and over again HE WILL PROTECT THOSE WHO LOVE HIM, NO MATTER WHAT. HIS LOVE CONQUERS ALL!

    Be Blessed

  22. O MY LORD IS IT NOT HYPOCRISY (DOUBLE MINEDNESS) TO SAY ONE LOVES YOU AND THEN CONTINUE IN DISOBEDIENCE AFTER HAVING BEEN SHOWN THE TRUTH HELP MY LORD I PRAY CLEANSE OUR HEARTS OUR SOULS OUR MINDS
    AND OUR BODIES THAT WE WOULD BE PURE FOR YOU AND THE FATHER PRAYING IN YOUR NAME JESUS AMEN

    James 1:6
    But let him ask in faith nothing wavering
    For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea
    driven with the wind and tossed

    James 1:7
    For let not that man think that he shall receive anything
    from the LORD

    James 1:8
    A double minded man is unstable in all his ways

    LOVING THE LORD JESUS

    • Hey Steve Morrow,

      I am not sure what your messages are exhorting us to. Your scriptures are everywhere and causing some confusion. Can you be a little more specific so we can receive the edification you seem to want to give us?

      But, I can tell you this: your prayer will not go above the room you are in because you are not asking according to the will of God. God does not clean our hearts, soul, mind and body. It is our human spirit He cleanses by the faith of Jesus.

      The Holy Spirit tells us to cleanse our hearts, and to do that by being transformed by the renewing of our minds having given our bodies as living sacrifices. (Romans 12:1,2 KJV) Jesus came to give us new spirits, by grace through faith, because our hearts are deceitful and desperately wicked.

      So, what’s up? Is this what you mean? Would you help us understand what you are telling us?

      Grace and the Peace of God

  23. Steve,

    May I ask are you referring to me?

    If so would you please explain so that I can understand.

    I am asking now because you respond after my posts most of the time and the responses seem or appear to directed towards my words.

    In the Love of Jesus our Savior please let me know.

    • Hi Donna. Referring to you? No. I did not read anyone’s comments. If I had commented/replied to anyone specifically, I would’ve hit the reply button to their specific comment, and it’d be threaded as such.
      My comments were in the base-queue to the original article itself.
      I’ve really struggled with this issue of inerrancy over the past 35 years, and a few years ago it finally clicked with me– Either God is sovereign, and can be trusted to maintain the integrity of the bible, or he is not in fact the True and Living God. At which point, I needed to move on to find the Real God.
      Think about the following though.
      If the bible is not a trustworthy document (and therefore inerrant), which parts CAN we trust? If the doctrine of salvation is true, but judgment is not, then how could I know that, because both are discussed with equal fervency. If the doctrine of works is true, but Grace is not, then how can I know that salvation by Grace is valid? With each doctrine/teaching/principle that the bible provides for us to know God better, they each make equal claims of equal authority, and validity. If the book does have errors in it, how can we know which ones are true, and which the errors have crept into? I see no way of knowing these.
      Therefore, since the God we read about in the bible is making the claim as being the ultimate, and final judge of all humanity, and has made the claim to send his Son to take our place, etc…… he is either capable of ensuring the integrity of the document, or he is not…. IF he’s not capable, willing, or able– then we are not following the True and Living God.
      This is why I decided to trust the claims made– that YHVH is the Sovereign God, and is, without once violating man’s free will, more than capable, and willing to maintain the integrity of the document.
      Once I did that– I found that not only is YHVH who he claims to be– he actually does fulfill his Word to all who will believe Him– as stated in Hebrews 11, and 2 Chronicles 16:9, etc….. YHVH is Faithful. He is Sovereign. We CAN depend on Him.

      • Hi Steve,

        More comfort from the Holy Spirit for us!!!
        Romans 3:3-23, KJV)

        NIV
        Rom 3:3 What if some did not have faith? Will their lack of faith nullify God’s faithfulness?
        Rom 3:4 Not at all! Let God be true, and every man a liar. As it is written: “So that you may be proved right when you speak and prevail when you judge.” [fn]
        Rom 3:5 But if our unrighteousness brings out God’s righteousness more clearly, what shall we say? That God is unjust in bringing his wrath on us? (I am using a human argument.)
        Rom 3:6 Certainly not! If that were so, how could God judge the world?
        Rom 3:7 Someone might argue, “If my falsehood enhances God’s truthfulness and so increases his glory, why am I still condemned as a sinner?”
        Rom 3:8 Why not say–as we are being slanderously reported as saying and as some claim that we say–“Let us do evil that good may result”? Their condemnation is deserved.
        Rom 3:9 What shall we conclude then? Are we any better [fn]? Not at all! We have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under sin.
        Rom 3:10 As it is written: “There is no one righteous, not even one;
        Rom 3:11 there is no one who understands, no one who seeks God.
        Rom 3:12 All have turned away, they have together become worthless; there is no one who does good, not even one.” [fn]
        Rom 3:13 “Their throats are open graves; their tongues practice deceit.” [fn] “The poison of vipers is on their lips.” [fn]
        Rom 3:14 “Their mouths are full of cursing and bitterness.” [fn]
        Rom 3:15 “Their feet are swift to shed blood;
        Rom 3:16 ruin and misery mark their ways,
        Rom 3:17 and the way of peace they do not know.” [fn]
        Rom 3:18 “There is no fear of God before their eyes.” [fn]
        Rom 3:19 Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God.
        Rom 3:20 Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin.
        Rom 3:21 But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify.
        Rom 3:22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,
        Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
        Rom 3:24 and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.

        Let God be true and everyman a liar. So be it!

        His and yours in Love,

        Dee

        • Awesome, and perfect passage for this topic. Another is Psalm 138:2. God has exalted His Word, above his name.
          For years, the basic idea of this seemed to fit the idea of inerrancy, but something didn’t quite fit right. Chuck Smith Sr. set it clear for me– God views His Word, more important than his name. This means– Obedience to the Word is taken more seriously by God, than just calling out his name, without obedience…. This is the point also of Titus 2:11-14, Phil. 3:15, and others.
          In the end, as Paul states– shall their unbelief make the faithfulness of God, without effect? Not in the slightest!
          Those who believe God will gain the benefit of his Kindness in Christ. Those who do not believe God will suffer great loss.
          Follow Jesus. He is the start and finish of all we Hold Dear, and True.

          • Amen! And faith toward God is not based on what you can see. It is the evidence of things not seen! Did God make all things by what He said? You betcha! How do we know, did we see Him do it? No. Do we believe it anyway? Yes! That is faith.

            God will verify His Word.

            Hallelujah!

            Be filled with the Peace of God,

            Dee

        • Matthew 4:4
          But HE answered and said
          It is written that man does NOT LIVE on
          bread alone but by —EVERY WORD THAT
          PROCEEDETH OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD

          Romans 3:31
          Do we then make void the law through faith
          —-GOD FORBID YEA WE ESTABLISH THE LAW—-

          Malachi 2:6
          For the law of truth was in his mouth and
          iniquity was not found in his lips
          he walked with ME in peace and equity
          AND DID TURN MANY AWAY FROM INIQUITY

          Titus 2:3-5
          The aged women likewise that they be in behavior as becometh holiness not false accusers not given to much wine teachers of good things
          (4)That they may teach the young women to be sober to love their husbands to love their children
          (5)To be discreet chaste keepers at home good
          obedient to their own husbands that the word
          OF GOD BE NOT BLASPHEMED

      • I was actually asking Steve Morrow.

        However, YHWH works in mysterious ways doesn’t he. As I too decided to trust Him completely Totally and and He is exactly who He says and I have watched Him move mountains for those who Love Him and seek to Know Him to thier best ability Keep His Word True.

        • Ah, gotcha…. I’d looked above and below to see if I missed something, so it seemed a bit off, but I thought it reasonable to respond anyway.

        • Dear Donna,

          Hallelujah! And sometimes YHWH’s ways are not so mysterious. The decision to trust is the first step to entering the peace of God and…We must rest: believe and trust (Philippians 4:6, 7; Hebrews 3:18, 19, KJV) and not allow the besetting sin of unbelief to steal what Jesus has died to give us.

          YHWH gifts us with His faith through Jesus because even our “best ability” is filthy rags and cannot keep us in His Light. Holy Spirit, we adore You!

          Grace and the Peace of YHWH to you!

          Dee

  24. Luke 12:1 In the mean time, when there were gathered together an innumerable multitude of people, insomuch that they trode one upon another, he began to say unto his disciples first of all, Beware ye of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.

    James 3:17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.

  25. Hyporcrisy is not double mindedness. Double mindedness is what some of these post have cause the childern of the Most High to feel. This is not from the Father above.

    Matthew 5:9 Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

    • Hey Steve Morrow,

      I am not sure what your messages are exhorting us to. Your scriptures are everywhere and causing some confusion. Can you be a little more specific so we can receive the edification you seem to want to give us?

      But, I can tell you this: your prayer will not go above the room you are in because you are not asking according to the will of God. God does not clean our hearts, soul, mind and body. It is our human spirit He cleanses by the faith of Jesus.

      The Holy Spirit tells us to cleanse our hearts, and to do that by being transformed by the renewing of our minds having given our bodies as living sacrifices. (Romans 12:1,2 KJV) Jesus came to give us new spirits, by grace through faith, because our hearts are deceitful and desperately wicked.

      So, what’s up? Is this what you mean? Would you help us understand what you are telling us?

      Grace and the Peace of God

  26. O MY LORD JESUS will you ever be unfaithful to our FATHER
    Were you ever unfaithful to the words HE instructed you to
    deliver to us
    Will you O LORD ever go against what the FATHER OUR HOLY GOD
    IN HEAVEN told you to do
    Help us my LORD that we would have YOUR FAITH—FAITHFULNESS—BELIEF—TRUST—AND OBEDIENCE Help us O LORD that we would wait on YOU to teach us the truth YOU came to freely give us and provided for us in the scriptures of the new and old testaments
    PRAYING IN YOUR NAME JESUS

    2 Timothy 3:16
    —ALL—scripture is given by inspiration of GOD and is profitable for doctrine for reproof for correction for instruction in RIGHTEOUSNESS

    Proverbs 18:2
    A fool hath no delight in understanding
    But that his heart may discover itself

    Proverbs 18:2 NASB
    A fool does not delight in understanding
    But only in revealing his own mind

    Proverbs 18:2 NIV
    A fool finds no pleasure in understanding
    But delights in airing his own opinions

    John 15:5
    I am the vine you are the branches
    He that abideth in ME and I in him
    The same bringeth forth much fruit
    —-FOR WITHOUT ME YOU CAN DO NOTHING—-

    Ephesians 5:24
    Therefore as the church is subject unto CHRIST
    So let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing

    Ephesians 5:25
    Husbands love your wives even as CHRIST also loved the
    church and gave HIMSELF for it

    Ephesians 5:26
    That HE might sanctify and —CLEANSE IT—
    —WITH THE WASHING OF WATER BY THE WORD—

    1 John 1:7
    —BUT IF—we walk in the light as HE is in the light
    we have fellowship one with another and the blood of
    JESUS CHRIST HIS SON—CLEANSETH US FROM ALL SIN—

    1 John 1:9
    —IF— we confess our sins HE is —FAITHFUL— and just to forgive us our sins
    and to —CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS

    Proverbs 8:8
    All the words of —MY MOUTH—are in righteousness
    There is nothing froward or perverse in them

    1 Corinthians 14:34
    Let your women keep silence in the churches
    For it is not permitted unto them to speak
    But they are commanded to be under obedience
    as also saith the law

    John 14:15
    IF you love ME keep MY commandments

    Psalm 119:172
    My tongue shall speak of thy word
    For all thy commandments are righteousness

    Psalm 119:138
    THY testimonies that thou hast commanded are righteous
    —AND VERY FAITHFUL—

    Psalm 119:86
    All THY commandments are—FAITHFUL—
    They persecute me wrongfully help thou me

    John 12:47
    And if any man hear MY words and believe not I judge him not
    For I came not to judge the world but to save the world

    John 12:48
    He that rejecteth ME and receiveth not MY words hath one that judgeth him
    The word that I have spoken the same shall judge him
    in the last day

    John 12:49
    For I have not spoken of MYSELF
    But the FATHER which sent ME
    HE gave ME a commandment what I should say
    and what I should speak

    John 12:50
    And I know that HIS commandment is life everlasting
    Whatsoever I speak therefore even as the FATHER said unto ME
    SO I SPEAK

    John 6:38
    Then Simon Peter answered HIM LORD to whom shall we go
    —THOU HAST THE WORDS OF ETERNAL LIFE—

    1 Timothy 2:5
    For there is one GOD and one mediator between GOD and men
    THE MAN JESUS CHRIST

    2 Timothy 2:15
    Study to show thyself approved unto GOD
    —A WORKMAN— that needeth not to be ashamed
    rightly dividing the word of truth

    Hebrews 2:1
    Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things
    which we have heard lest at any time we should let them slip

    Acts 5:29
    Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said
    We ought to —OBEY GOD RATHER THAN MEN—

    LOVING THE LORD JESUS CHRIST

  27. Hello again to you Jerry S,

    Yes, this is a hot blog dealing with belief in the sovereignty of God, His Word as His Light, the origin of spiritual life and idolatry. The scriptural exhortations are yummy!

    First, let me be clear that I do not deal or delve in the metaphysical or mystical. Both perspectives are from human soulish ideas resulting in vain philosophy (Colossians 2:8, KJV). And neither should you! As you said, you take the word for what it plainly says. My perspective is God’s perspective, spiritual. Not because I am anything or so smart or without flaws, but because by faith from God, I believe the scriptures, live in them and judge by them with the help of the Holy Spirit. Just wanted to clarify terms, as you requested. LOL!

    Secondly, I wrote to you earlier in the blog concerning your quest for information and understanding of a New Covenant, other than the one God made with Israel, but with all the conversation it got buried. Here it is again. I will also put it at the end of the blog in case you don’t get back here! I hope it will help to address that open-ended questions you have.

    Grace and Peace

    August 28, 2012 at 10:23 am #

    Hi Jerry S,

    Here are some New Covenant scriptures for you. But the New Covenant is not based on the law or keeping the law, as so many Covenant and replacement theologists teach, or only with Israel. In Jesus, the middle wall of partition between Jew and gentile is broken down. (Ephesians 2:11-22, KJV). The New Covenant is based on Spiritual Life ratified by the shed spiritual blood of Jesus.

    Hbr 9:15 For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance–now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

    Hbr 9:28 …so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many [not all] people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

    Hbr 12:24 …to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.

    Paul says, as he teaches the gentiles:

    1Cr 11:25 In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.”

    and

    2Cr 3:6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant–not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

    God has made a new covenant, not only with Israel but will all those He will call through the faith of Jesus. It is not a covenant of the letter, but a covenant of the spirit which will have the spiritual laws written in our hearts by our new spirits.

    Yes, replacement theology has demonic origins, denying the covenant the Father made with the Hebrew fathers, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. God is Faithful, He will never break a promise.

    I love Him!

    Peace,

    Dee

    • Hello Dee, Thank you for the encouraging words. You replied to my comments in different places so let me reply to them here and move on from this string.

      The trees; now you’re the one couching the argument… I’m not limited to a choice between only the two you mention 😉

      The New Covenant; every time the phrase “a New Covenant” is expressed in NT scripture it is speaking of Jer. 31; 31-34 that Yeshua evoked at the Passover Seder and ratified by HIS Blood on the tree of sacrifice.

      Thank you for joining the discussion. This is what I hoped it would be.

      J.

  28. Hi Barbara LeFevre,

    Again, your response above is disingenuous (look it up), but I do accept your apology. Let me also say to you that I am not angry or offended by you or anyone here. I believe the Holy Spirit when He shows me, and tells me:

    2Ti 2:23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

    I will not continue discussing the issue you responded to above. It is off topic. But I hope we can share our understandings of God’s perspective in more sincere conversation. (1Peter 2:2 KJV)

    Grace and God’s Peace

    Dee

  29. Matthew 15:7
    YOU hypocrites well did Isaiah prophesy of you saying

    Matthew 15:8
    THIS PEOPLE DRAWETH NIGH UNTO ME WITH THEIR MOUTH
    AND HONORETH ME WITH THEIR LIPS
    BUT THEIR HEART IS—–FAR——FROM ME

    Matthew 15:9
    BUT IN VAIN THEY DO WORSHIP ME
    TEACHING FOR DOCTRINES THE COMMANDMENTS OF MEN

    Matthew 23:23
    WOE unto you scribes and pharisees hypocrites
    for you pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin
    and have omitted the weightier matters of the law and judgement
    these ought you to have done and not to leave the other undone

    Matthew 23:27
    Woe unto you scribes and pharisees hypocrites
    for you are lkie unto whited sepulcres which indeed appear beautiful outward but are within full of dead mans bones

    Ezekiel 33:31
    And they come unto thee as the people cometh and they sit before
    thee as MY people and they hear MY words but they will not do them FOR WITH THEIR MOUTH THEY SHOW MUCH LOVE
    —–BUT THEIR HEART GOETH AFTER THEIR COVETOUSNESS—–

    Ephesians 5:3
    But fornication —-AND ALL UNCLEANNESS OR COVETOUSNESS—-
    let it not be once named among you as becometh saints

    1 Corinthians 15:34
    Awake to righteousness and sin not
    For some have not the knowledge of GOD
    I speak this to your shame

    1 Corinthians 11;1
    be ye followers of me even as I also am of CHRIST

    1 Thessalonians 2:10
    You are witnesses and GOD also how holily and justly and unblameably we behaved ourselves among you that believe

    John 14:15
    —IF—you ME keep MY commandments

    LOVING THE LORD

  30. It’s 3 am on the right coast and I woke from my sleep with this thought and I hope it is not the last word on this subject (pun intended). It has only been in recent times that those of us with the means have had the ability to go to a local book store and buy a bible with the money in our purse. It’s only been the last few hundred years that we have even had the ability to mass produce any printed word to read. How have the Believers of the years previous been able carry on without the bible to readily refer to for guidance, inerrant or not? For that matter there are many, many people alive today who are in this very same situation. Our faith is in HIM. HE is capable (emphasis on the person). HE is coming back and HE is not going to be carrying a bible in HIS hand but a sword. And this sword is going to be there to defend the Jews in Jerusalem in Israel from their attackers. At least I am going to be sure I’m on the correct side of that argument.
    J.

    • Well, I guess this is so long, Jerry, until we meet on another blog. LOL!

      But first, I want to sum up what I am taking away from this edifying discussions on Chris’ BLB blog.

      There is no inerrancy or contradiction in the inspired words of God written down by His chosen vessels. As many have said here, God is sovereign and has protected His truth to work out His finished plan. God’s elect, in these days where we have the scriptures written down and widely available, must always, by the Holy Spirit, compare scripture with scripture to understand God’s meaning and purpose. (2 Peter 1:20; 1 Corinthians 2:4,5 KJV) We are told that deceivers have gone out into the world (Titus 1:10 KJV; 2John 1:7 KJV), whose satanic purpose is to destroy the purposes of God and the people of God. These deceivers have been and are included among the copyists, translators, document keepers, archivists, counsels, church leaders, etc., for all the scriptures and doctrine, Old Testament (research the origin of LXX!) and New, and have attempted to tamper with original documents and doctrine. But, again, as said on this great blog thread many times, God is sovereign: omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent, the originator and sustainer of all things! Worshipers of the bible are idolators, not His elect, not His children. He has an ekklesia (church) without spot or wrinkle, and will have a new heaven, a new earth and a New Jerusalem!

      Now, I have been asking the Lord to understand what you are saying about the New Covenant. I don’t know that this is the place to pursue this thought but I don’t know where else to respond to your comments. So, this is what I understand, so far. If anyone wants, you may ask for my email for fellowship.

      The prophecy in Jeremiah is for the nation of Israel (Jeremiah 31:31 KJV). One of the spiritual explanations (among many) towards the fulfillment of God’s plan, is given to us in Hebrews. It not only confirms that the New Covenant is given to the Nation of Israel but reveals, to the Jews (Hebrews), how Jesus is the mediator of that new covenant by His blood sacrifice, under a new priesthood (Melchizedek not Levi). (Hebrews 8:7, 8, 13; 10:15-17 NLT).

      So, yes, I think I understand your view about the New Covenant being given to the nation of Israel as prophesied by Jeremiah. That fact gets lost under religious dogma. There is not a separate new covenant for gentiles! The new covenant in Jesus, is the fulfillment of the prophetic promises made to the fathers (Abraham, Isaac and Jacob) for the nation of Israel.

      However, just as the mixed multitude (gentiles) that followed the Israelites out of Egypt could become Jews, blessed and beloved of God, if they fell under and kept the laws and feasts of the Old Testament set up by God. So, it is that the gentiles can enter into the New Covenant made with the “House of Israel and the House of Judah”, through faith in Jesus (who kept all the laws of the old covenant), by the sovereign election (calling) of God (Romans 9:24-26).

      As God unrolls or progressively reveals His plan, we see that the promise of God given to the fathers of the nation of Israel (Genesis 12:1-3, for example) which covers blessing to all the families of the earth–gentiles all–is included under that new covenant (Hosea 2:23), through faith in God by His Son Jesus. And this reality is taught to us by the Holy Spirit in the Acts, through Paul, and the other apostles.

      The significance of gentiles not needing to embrace Jewish customs and attempt to keep the laws as under the old covenant (but needing to adhere to certain spiritual realities, so to speak, Acts 15) is also made clearer to me. It clarifies the necessity for Paul to justly rebuke the gentiles for our arrogance in believing that God would set aside His chosen people and not save any of them because of sin and disobedience! Hypocrisy! It shows up how the gentiles, having used another religion, a mixture called Christianity, twists things, a sleight of hand causing confusion, obscuring the truth of His purpose, creating new laws and creeds to follow based on the letter of the “new testament”. The New Testament (Covenant) is portrayed as the written 2nd half of a “bible”, given to the gentiles founded on the 1st half, as taught in religion and the world. But God revealed why He preserved these documents. (2 Timothy 3:16). According to God’s sovereign plan, even now the apostasy has put the Living Jesus outside the camp of “church” (Rev 3:20).

      Ah, the wonderful sovereignty of the Almighty God. God’s ways and thoughts are higher than ours. We are strongly admonished by the Holy Spirit not to be deceived. For me, I have a new perspective of His plan concerning His chosen, set apart Jewish remnant (Hebrews 10:14 KJV), and the gentiles He also called (Hosea 2:23).

      Jerry S, thanks for your contending for the faith which was once delivered.

      Grace and much Peace,

      Dee

    • Agreed Jerry, today is the exception. At no other time in history has the Word of God been so available. These blogs, discussions, virtual forums and retrieval of multiple verses of scripture readied for the desired emphasis through the wonder of digital media, all are evidences, signs of this time that must be noted. This outpouring of His Word, certainly the Spirit of His purpose reveal a great moment of our Father is upon us. There was only one ark built even though it was too great an endeavor to be hidden. Noah is called a preacher of righteousness yet his audience was not convinced. So then let us consider the larger message of scripture. The OT itself is a sign that pointed to the real propitiatory sacrifice, righteousness for whosoever will that is the NT or more appropriately the love of God conquers sin and death. Is this the time? His Word certainly is known throughout the world.

      • It is the same Spirit that indwelt the apostles, disciples and martyrs that speaks through these discussions, praise to His Holy Name, Jesus! I love to read of faith in the sovereign God Who has provided us the Word of truth. Regarding bibliolatry, replacement theory and such, it is imperative to know the literal purpose expressed through the bible apart from investigations of who, what or where to prove or disprove but rather to obtain the superhuman perspective. We need to hear what is intended.
        Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.
        Mat 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
        2Cr 5:21 For he hath made him [to be] sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
        2Cr 5:21 For he hath made him [to be] sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
        Mar 8:32-38

  31. 2 Kings 22:8
    And Hilkiah the high priest said unto Shaphan the scribe
    I have found the book of the law in the house of the LORD and Hilkiah gave the book to Shaphan and he read it

    2 Kings 22:10&11
    And Shaphan the scribe showed the king saying Hilkiah the preist hath delivered me a book and Shaphan read it before the king
    (11)And it came to pass when the king had read the book of the law
    He rent his clothes

    Nehemiah 9:3
    And they stood up in their place and read in the book of the law of the LORD THEIR GOD one fourth part of the day and another fourth part they confessed and worshiped the LORD THEIR GOD

    Jeremiah 26:2
    Thus saith THE LORD stand in the court of the LORDS house and speak unto all the cities of Judah which come to worship in the
    LORDS house all the words that I command thee to speak unto them
    DIMINISH NOT A WORD

    Acts 5:20
    Go stand and speak in the temple to the people all the words of this life

    Acts 17:11
    These were more noble than those in Thessalonica in that they received the word with —ALL READINESS OF MIND—and searced
    the scriptures —DAILY—whether those things were true

    Isaiah 30_9
    That this is a rebellious people —lying children— chidren that will not hear the law of THE LORD

    Ephesians 2:2
    Wherein in time past you walked according to the course of this world according to the prince of the power of the air the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedince

    John 14:15
    If you love ME keep MY commandments